Tips Music Limited (TIPSMUSIC) Earnings Call Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Q3 FY '22 Earnings Conference Call of Tips Industries Limited. Today on this call, we have with us Mr. Kumar Taurani, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr. Girish Taurani, Executive Director; Mr. Sunil Chellani, CFO; and Mr. Avtarsingh Jeswani, Vice President, Accounts and Finance; and the Investor Relations Partner, Orient Capital. This conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on beliefs, opinions and expectations of the company as on the date of this call. These statements are not the guarantees of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Kumar Taurani, Chairman and Managing Director of Industries Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you so much. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to Q3 FY '22 earnings call of Tips Industries. I hope you and your families are safe and taking the due precaution during the pandemic. I'm happy to report a good quarter in terms of music releases and operational and financial performance of your company. This quarter, Tips Industries has released 86 new songs, which is the highest number of songs released in any quarter so far in this financial year, which brings us to the total released songs for 9 months at 203 songs. We have released all songs of -- for 2 big Punjabi films, namely, Yes I am Student and Honsla Rakh. We have released 11 remaining songs of project Tips Rewind, Season 1: Tribute to Ghazal Maestro Jagjit Singh under Tips Originals, which has received very good response in the Ghazal genre. We have also released 2 new songs, namely Bollywood Wala Dance and Meri Zindagi Mein under Tips Originals, which have also got a great response. Our new Bhojpuri song, Tumsa Koi Pyaara by Pawan Singh and Priyanka Singh crossed 60 million YouTube views. Song was released on 10th December. As far as Film division is concerned, the Film division did not have any new releases this quarter. The viewership on various digital platforms is seeing steady growth with the Internet penetration in the rural markets, and we are well placed to capitalize on that. Now let me hand over the call to Mr. Sunil Chellani, our CFO, to share the financial highlights of the quarter. Yes, Mr. Chellani.

Thank you, sir. Good afternoon, and warm welcome to our Q3 FY '22 earnings call. Let me take you through the highlight now. Our revenue from operations for Q3 FY '22 stood at INR 44.2 crores as compared to INR 31.4 crores for Q3 FY '21, a growth of 41%. For Q3 FY '22, Music revenue grew by 43% to INR 44.9 crores compared to same period last year. For the 9 months ended 31st December 2021, total business revenue grew by 167% to INR 168.1 crores compared to the same period last year. EBIT exclusive of other income stood INR 25.5 crores for Q3 FY '22, a growth of 38% as compared to same quarter last year, and EBIT margin was at 58% for the same quarter. EBIT from Music segment stood at INR 28.3 crores, an increase of 23% Y-to-Y and EBIT margin was at 63%. Profit after tax stood at INR 19.9 crores for Q3 FY '22 with a profit margin of 45%. PAT growth on Y-to-Y basis was at 61%. With this, I open the floor for discussion. Thank you, gentlemen.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Akshay Sam from SAM Capital.

Taurani ji, firstly, congrats to you and your entire team for fantastic numbers. Sir, first question was on growth. Sir, where did majority of the growth come from? Was this because of renegotiation of contracts with the existing platforms or minimum guarantee [Foreign Language]. Can you explain where did the majority of the growth come from? Because you guided for around 30%, and we did much better than that.

Mainly growth was from our new releases. [Foreign Language] This year, already, we have released 3 Punjabi films and 203 songs we have released by 9 months. So majority [Foreign Language] from overall people [Foreign Language]. And all streaming platforms also doing well. [Foreign Language] It's a mixture of everything basically.

Okay. So this growth is sustainable for the upcoming quarters [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language] for next 3, 4 years, 5 years. So that will -- I am quite sure, quite confident [Foreign Language]. I stand on that.

Okay. Sir, also, what was the content cost in music this quarter?

[Foreign Language]

Other expenses [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language] We have concentrated on quality in content, year-on-year basis. [Foreign Language] But now we are very aggressive on that front. But then also, with aggressive, we are really keeping a check on quality [Foreign Language] but we will be very careful about the acquisition strategy. So we are very careful and we have our experience on that as well. So that should, everything is fine.

Sir, last question before I join the queue. [Foreign Language] with any other platforms from your side? [Foreign Language] you're still in discussion with a few. And also, what big releases can we look forward to in the next few quarters? That's all from my end.

As far as negotiations are concerned [Foreign Language] whether he is selling my content or he is not selling my content. [Foreign Language] because they need me, I need them. We both need each other. But maybe sometimes situations [Foreign Language]. And as far as content is concerned, we have already acquired a big film from Balaji Telefilms, film called -- Kartik Aaryan film. Film name is Freddy. [Foreign Language] Pritam is #1 today in music composers. I'm quite confident we will have a very nice, good songs. Four songs we will get, minimum commitment is there. [Foreign Language] So we are looking at that as well. [Foreign Language].

The next question is from the line of Anika Mittal from Nvest Research.

Hello, is my line audible?

Yes, yes.

It was wonderful to see the results. And obviously, it is only increasing our confidence in your company. So I have a few questions, sir. Number one, what is an update on this demerger, sir? I know that you updated that it should be done by Q1. But do you have any further details that you can share?

See, as far as demerger is concerned, [Foreign Language] there is a lot of agencies involved, exchanges, courts, NCLT, many, many follow-ups has to be done. [Foreign Language] They are really doing good job. I'm expecting now it will be done in March -- before March or maximum April. That is the deadline I have got from my experts who is handling this job. So let's see.

Second question is when I see the earnings presentation, sir, I see some reduction in viewership. So can you explain like are we seeing any -- while revenues are obviously moving northwards, but I see a reduction in viewership. Is that anything that we can clarify?

[Foreign Language].

Okay. Okay, sir. And any specific strategy that you can let us know on your coverage on regional side, sir, if you can share with us some strategy.

See, I can't give you all the details, but I can assure you one thing. And what I'm looking -- actually, last -- I think 3 quarters or 2 quarters back, I have told you, we are not big time there in the new releases. And we have started -- last year onwards, we started new releases. We have to just see the trend. But my expectation is [Foreign Language] and you have not recovered money on that song, but there are these 2 super hit numbers, you've recovered extra monies on that, what you have projected. But in totality, you have recovered all the costs. So I maintain and whatever released till now, we have released Punjabi, we released 203 songs. And last year also, we have released 200 songs. So what I see, [Foreign Language]. So that's a good thing. I'm happy about that. [Foreign Language] so that is -- and we should maintain that. [Foreign Language] That's really good for music label.

Last question, if I can ask. I see a drop in margin, while we are obviously reporting very extraordinary margins in the industry who don't -- nobody has these margins. But any specific reason that you see there is a specific drop in the margin this quarter?

Percentage-wise, may be talking percentage-wise, we have a drop. Because of the new content [Foreign Language] big-time investment we are going to do in new releases. But my target is I should maintain, even at bottom line, year-on-year, I should maintain 15%, 20%. [Foreign Language] We write-off entire content cost in the same quarter. So that can have an impact on the bottom line [Foreign Language] because of only that reason, nothing else. So I think you judge us on a top line basis, I feel. And plus, I feel if you -- what I'm saying, 25%, 30%, what I can assume and I'm seeing [Foreign Language] YouTube is making more money, they are making -- giving us more money, streaming platforms also doing well. TV stations doing well. So touch wood everything is going well. So I don't see any problem [Foreign Language] because of content, and I have to do that [Foreign Language] over 10, 15 years, so I need that content also and we should invest that.

The next question is from the line of Saket Mehrotra from Tusk Investments.

Thank you for a great set of numbers. [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language].

Yes. [Foreign Language] we can monitor our income every day.

Right. Right. And pressing more on YouTube, right? So what I have seen is whenever I open up trending songs in India [Foreign Language]. So is this a conscious strategy that we've been doing? I understand some of these channels are old. [Foreign Language] So is this something that we'll continue to do? Or is this like a conscious way to keep recycling our old content?

[Foreign Language].

Great. Second question, Taurani ji, on this WMG partnership. [Foreign Language] So has something to do in this explosive growth that you've seen with your partnership with WMG? Is that -- could that be one of the reasons? Or is this contract up for renewal? [Foreign Language] if you can let us in on that?

See, WMG, we did a deal with them in 2020 September and that deal is till 2024 March. [Foreign Language] but there are some conditions. We have to give them certain new releases and we are confident [Foreign Language]. There is a lot of money lying with us as an advance from them. So that every quarter, they give us a statement [Foreign Language].

Great. Great. And Taurani ji, what do you get a sense of with respect to, let's say, these incomes that you get from collection societies? I understand this quarter, [Foreign Language] right at the peak of the going out season. So how do you see this evolving? And do you see any green shoots in that it will stay like this?

[Foreign Language] but we are -- touch wood, by the grace of God, we are okay and we are doing really good. Even society is also giving me whatever -- what I actually predicted -- projected [Foreign Language] 30%, but they are giving me more than that. So I'm quite -- I'm positive [Foreign Language].

The next question is from the line of Kamal Verma from Morgan Stanley.

I just had a few questions. So I'm new to this company, but I just wanted to understand a few things. One is just in terms of your revenue split, how much is it coming from music streaming apps, how much from YouTube, how much from other sources?

See, I can't share you that because that is a -- I see it's a competition. We are living in a competition world. So I can't really reveal that. But I can tell you, digital is always around 65%, 70%.

Okay. Got it. Second thing I just want to understand just in terms of your peers and acquisition. So I mean, currently, what I'm looking at is you're acquiring roughly from an annual run rate perspective, roughly 300 songs maybe in a year, right? Some of the peers might be even doing more, and we are generating, I mean, decent amount of cash flows to maybe pursue even more. Just wanted to get an understanding from you, how much is this in terms of the total market available in India each year? How much percentage? And can we do more or do we want to do more maybe just -- we are just waiting for the right price and only then we would want to buy out more songs? The reason I'm asking this question is, of course, currently, our revenue growth has been pretty strong, and there are a lot of tailwinds to this industry. But over time, after 5, 7 years, of course, how much you buy -- I mean, the revenue growth will resemble very much how much you grow your song library, right? So that's why I just wanted to press upon this question in terms of how are you -- in terms of how much aggression do you sort of want to have in terms of acquiring new songs? And how much are we acquiring in terms of the overall market available right now?

See, we are aggressive in acquiring a quality content. And touch wood, we have experience also, we can also create music. We can also -- some movies, small movies we take, we give them our own songs. [Foreign Language] and you just put it in your film. Give us a situation, we'll make a song. We have a team of 6, 7 good creative people. They can make a song and give it to them. So we have that various kind of models we work. So I don't feel -- and being a 30, 35 years relationship we have in the industry and brand. So I don't have any problem regarding that. I can get any content I want, but there is a price issue. It can happen because of the competition, everybody want you have good content. [Foreign Language] that problem we will have. [Foreign Language] but then we have to manage. [Foreign Language] say, if we have targeted this year, in case we want -- just as an example [Foreign Language].

got it. So roughly, I think, it takes 3 to 4 years, maybe maximum for payback...

[Foreign Language] again, depending upon the content [Foreign Language]. They are really in a very comfortable situation.

Okay. And in terms of pricing over the last, let's say, 5, 6 quarters, what has been the trend? Again, I said, I'm new to this company. But in terms of pricing, how has it moved for your own library of songs?

Pricing of what?

Pricing contracts with streaming apps or -- I mean, how has the pricing moved?

They are giving me money, is that you are talking about?

Right, right.

Yes, I'm growing. I said -- I told you we don't have to see an individual. [Foreign Language] individual app is not doing well, but maybe some other app is doing very well. So overall, I'm seeing, I should make 25%, 30% extra, which is very comfortable. I feel we achieve that.

The next question is from the line of Ankit Babel from Shubkam Ventures.

Congrats for a good set of numbers. There are a few questions. Sir, which are major platforms that are still not our client?

Which are not our client? [Foreign Language] It's not only with the Tips label. It's with all the companies. [Foreign Language] that happens in this industry. [Foreign Language] so not to worry. [Foreign Language] if you are a music listener, you like music [Foreign Language].

Okay. Okay. And sir, you also mentioned that the share of paid viewers increased in YouTube. So by paid views means on YouTube, those viewers who have a paid subscription of YouTube, right?

Paid subscription [Foreign Language] then I'm not getting any revenue.

Okay. Okay. And sir, just a question from my understanding. Sir, you have a library of around 30,000 songs. So whenever you deal with a customer, all your 30,000 songs at one go is there on that platform?

Not really. [Foreign Language] we are converting all those other songs into videos, proper videos or lyrical videos and we are putting. Every month, we put many, many videos on YouTube. [Foreign Language].

But sir, what I have witnessed is [Foreign Language] how come that happens?

[Foreign Language] Girish, my son, has actually joined me in business as COO. He is the COO of the company. When he came to the business, he did all the old [Foreign Language]. We have done that very big exercise and still that is going on.

So you feel that you actually have more than 29,000 songs library.

No, no, no. Songs are 29,000 but [Foreign Language].

Audio is updated. Audio is already there.

Yes, yes. Audio is already there. [Foreign Language].

Okay. And sir, lastly, sir, though you have clarified, just a reconfirmation that you mentioned that given the visibility, you can grow at 30% for next 3, 4, 5 years. But at the same time, you are focusing on aggressively buying some quality content also. But sir, do you feel that, that aggression can come at the cost of margins? I mean -- or can we see that profit also should be growing at least at 30%?

30% will be difficult [Foreign Language]. Other companies, worldwide companies, they do write-off in 4 years, 5 years, 6 years, [Foreign Language]. So that can really impact us to some extent. And I don't want to change that because [Foreign Language] from that time, we are doing this policy. We are aggressive. I don't want to change that [Foreign Language] to inflate profit or whatever, I do that. No, I don't like to do that. I want to maintain this way. This is the correct position we are telling you all. [Foreign Language].

So on a normalized basis, you can meet your revenue growth targets and profit also. Some year, it will come down. Some year, it may go up.

[Foreign Language] That's not a practice. Even I'm doing that, my thinking is [Foreign Language].

We'll move on to the next question, that is from the line of [Vik Lamba] from [Lamba Investments].

Sir, is it possible to divide in our revenue? Generally, how much does it come from new content for a period? And how much is basically old library? Is it possible to divide it that way?

Not in the report. But after 2, 3 years, we will start that practice because now actually, we are starting acquiring new content. [Foreign Language] we'll do that. Actually -- yes, sorry, go on.

Because as you write off the total thing in the same quarter, this will be a good idea. That will give a good sense of that how much is it coming from the old and how much is new. Then the way you're saying is that we can -- cost can be absorbed that way and then revenue can also be compared from the new content.

[Foreign Language] because we are in the competition world, you don't want to reveal all the numbers. But we'll see how things develop. [Foreign Language] Let's wait for that for 2, 3 quarters at least, we'll see that [Foreign Language].

Okay. And sir, like in post-COVID world, it has been seen that maybe digital usership growth may slow down a bit as even Netflix in guidance or -- has come down internationally. Do you see even an impact in our business also?

On the contrary, [Foreign Language] you'll consume lots of music. Plus post-COVID, people will go crazy. [Foreign Language] they will travel, they will eat food, they will party, they will dance, they will do shows [Foreign Language]. So you will make a lot of money on that front as well. I can't actually share a few numbers, but [Foreign Language] you will be amazed. [Foreign Language] I see that, that level will also come in the next 2, 3, 4 years. [Foreign Language].

Okay. And one last question. Sir, in your movie business, what is the long-term plan in terms of what is the kind of revenue we target to get on a yearly basis? Because just to get a sense on that, I know some kind of plan in that.

Yes. Movie business -- at present, actually, we are focusing big time on a music business. Movie business, yes, there is a focus. There is some [Foreign Language] but let this demerger happen, then we will do something on that as well, and we will tell you. In next to -- not next quarter, next to next quarter, we will present what is our plan for music -- sorry, film business as well.

And sir, [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language] DVDs came, then also this happened. Now also this is happening. But you see, music company [Foreign Language] worldwide. I'm not saying only we. You just see, worldwide growth is happening. [Foreign Language] come back to -- what you said -- what question is it?

[Foreign Language].

It's one time. It's one time. No revenue share deal happening in the industry. [Foreign Language] onetime money.

The next question is from the line of Ankush Agrawal from Surge Capital.

Firstly, [Foreign Language] the entire past library that we have, that is mostly lump sum paid to, right? [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language] we all -- from beginning, we have bought all the music on a lump sum basis. [Foreign Language] even going forward, same model we are continuing. No liability, nothing.

Okay. Onetime lump sum. No minimum guarantee and no royalty.

No. No royalty guarantee. Only just -- no minimum guarantee. No royalty. All one time. [Foreign Language] whatever happens to that content, it's our problem.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] so we are very comfortable and people are really -- I shouldn't praise myself, but people are really happy with us. [Foreign Language] there is no controversy at all. [Foreign Language] all smooth. So that relationship really counts. And people are really -- our industry is really happy with us.